Those OEM wheels...they remind me of flower petals.
The sweet spot -and the real sleeper- is the 201 hp
turbocharged 2014 SX variant with a six-speed manual or a 6-speed
slushbox (upgraded to 7 gears in 2017) if that's your desire. 0-60 is
around 6.7 seconds...the same as the manual-only 2014 Ford Fiesta ST. KBB on a 2014 is just $13K ($14K for the Fiesta ST) for what is essentially a
new car with some warranty still left. That's a screaming deal for
those fraidy-cats that can't or won't contemplate buying a truly used car.
Like. Makes more sense to me than a Golf. Perfect for a town runabout or college kid, minus the turbo. The turbo sounds like fun and I'll bet it's useful on the freeway, so that one would be for me. I wonder what the headroom is like? The Mazda3 and Ford F-twins are too short inside for me.
Yes, Kia and Hyundai have very good records for reliability, since close to 10 years now. Also, until recently their cars were less technology laden, and as a result could be counted on to age gracefully. I don't know about the current crop, but everybody seems to be rushing to cram as many gewgaws as possible into everything with wheels.
This Kia is a sister of the Elantra Touring, also a nice compact wagon/hatch.
Thanks for the reminder about the ET, B! I picked the Forte5 over it because of the available turbo gasoline engine (and we've recently discussed it anyway), which in my opinion pushes it into sleeper territory when paired with the manual.
Unfortunately, the days of less tech, as you mentioned, seem to be over for K-H...even the base Rio (which starts at $14K US) has doodads like...take a deep breath here...ABS, ESC, VSM, EBD, HAC and TPMS.
There's no such thing as a basic car from the Koreans any longer. I'd guess that it's pretty much impossible to buy a new car like that from ANY manufacturer in this country at this point in time.
I had to look up VSM, EBD, and HAC. Sigh! I just can't imagine how these high-tech laden cars are going to age.
I have lived most of my life with at least one geriatric vehicle in my fleet (occasionally as the ONLY vehicle in the fleet; not good times!). I have become reasonably skilled at being able to manage a collection of minor malfunctions. There are not many single malfunctions that would prevent me getting home. It is the combos that will eventually catch up with me, and result in the geriatric beast being taken out behind the barn to be put out of its misery.
But with all this interconnected wizardry, I imagine that a relatively minor failure (such as the inevitable corroded electrical connections) will render these beasts immobile. Worse, I think it will rapidly become economically prohibitive to repair them, either due to diagnostic cost or the obsolescence of some module or other.
In the bigger picture, I think we will see the disappearance of older vehicles in the road fleet. Some will argue that this would be good for the environment, due to advances in emission control technology (nobody mention VW, OK?). However, as far as I know it is still true that an automobile's greatest carbon footprint comes at manufacture. Once you have bought the thing, the kindest action for the planet is to keep it running for a very long time.
Referring to another of K2's blog posts, I wonder if I can sneak a Dacia Sandero into the country....
You know, if you'd asked me what I thought about this subject six months ago, I'd wholeheartedly agree with you. But I've been talking to WD about this some more and he pointed out that there are all sorts of orgs popping up that are focused on issues like this and will most likely keep the complicated electronics in cars alive for the foreseeable future. FIVA is one group that has called for action on this subject. I have the feeling this all could lead to a thriving industry supporting these things many years after their intended lifespan, sort of like the fervor over yesterday's computers and electronics.
Yes, FIVA (and the national body FFVE in France) are very active in trying to get ahead of the curve on the tide of anti-auto-ism. I have not heard of them starting any initiatives regarding sourcing electronic components. I did not find it on their (rather awkward) web site. Can you point me to something specific?
No problem! Even though there's nothing that I could find about it on their website, here's a direct quote as evidence to the contrary. The article itself is more detailed. Let me know if you want me to post the entire contents of it.
"FIVA wants automaker heritage departments to address this (...preserve the technology...) at the 2016 Heritage Forum in Chantilly in early September."
Source: Page 15 of Hemmings Sport & Exotic Car, August 2016
Thanks K2. FIVA looks to form links to as many potential partners as possible (very wise). That initiative about heritage technology is a good way to engage with the auto makers, even though their historical interest has been to force older cars out of the fleet (see various cash-for-clunkers programs, which have been VERY big in Europe). Getting that small concession for registered-as-historic vehicles from the mayor of Paris also was smart. Sadly, all of this points to the inevitability of older cars being ghetto-ized, but maybe we have to accept that. The average drivers of "just an old car" are not politically organized enough to defend their interests
My current thinking (subject to change on a whim) is that there will be businesses and groups that will form when the need arises.
But that may not necessarily be what actually happens. Instead, it may be down to the magic of online communication that solves the problem. Videos like the one below are so plentiful already, that it's pretty easy to envision that even the most complicated problems can be solved by resourceful enthusiasts. Even fragile electronic parts made of unobtanium have solutions, work-arounds and hacks. It all just depends on desire.
I'm not so sure that it will be a problem. Well, not MUCH of a problem.
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Like. Makes more sense to me than a Golf. Perfect for a town runabout or college kid, minus the turbo. The turbo sounds like fun and I'll bet it's useful on the freeway, so that one would be for me. I wonder what the headroom is like? The Mazda3 and Ford F-twins are too short inside for me.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the reliability on these things?
ReplyDeleteBuh-bam!
ReplyDelete"(Kia/Hyundai is) rated the No. 1 brand in J.D. Power's annual survey of new model reliability."
Truth. I didn't make it up.
Yes, Kia and Hyundai have very good records for reliability, since close to 10 years now. Also, until recently their cars were less technology laden, and as a result could be counted on to age gracefully. I don't know about the current crop, but everybody seems to be rushing to cram as many gewgaws as possible into everything with wheels.
DeleteThis Kia is a sister of the Elantra Touring, also a nice compact wagon/hatch.
Thanks for the reminder about the ET, B! I picked the Forte5 over it because of the available turbo gasoline engine (and we've recently discussed it anyway), which in my opinion pushes it into sleeper territory when paired with the manual.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, the days of less tech, as you mentioned, seem to be over for K-H...even the base Rio (which starts at $14K US) has doodads like...take a deep breath here...ABS, ESC, VSM, EBD, HAC and TPMS.
There's no such thing as a basic car from the Koreans any longer. I'd guess that it's pretty much impossible to buy a new car like that from ANY manufacturer in this country at this point in time.
I had to look up VSM, EBD, and HAC. Sigh! I just can't imagine how these high-tech laden cars are going to age.
DeleteI have lived most of my life with at least one geriatric vehicle in my fleet (occasionally as the ONLY vehicle in the fleet; not good times!). I have become reasonably skilled at being able to manage a collection of minor malfunctions. There are not many single malfunctions that would prevent me getting home. It is the combos that will eventually catch up with me, and result in the geriatric beast being taken out behind the barn to be put out of its misery.
But with all this interconnected wizardry, I imagine that a relatively minor failure (such as the inevitable corroded electrical connections) will render these beasts immobile. Worse, I think it will rapidly become economically prohibitive to repair them, either due to diagnostic cost or the obsolescence of some module or other.
In the bigger picture, I think we will see the disappearance of older vehicles in the road fleet. Some will argue that this would be good for the environment, due to advances in emission control technology (nobody mention VW, OK?). However, as far as I know it is still true that an automobile's greatest carbon footprint comes at manufacture. Once you have bought the thing, the kindest action for the planet is to keep it running for a very long time.
Referring to another of K2's blog posts, I wonder if I can sneak a Dacia Sandero into the country....
You know, if you'd asked me what I thought about this subject six months ago, I'd wholeheartedly agree with you. But I've been talking to WD about this some more and he pointed out that there are all sorts of orgs popping up that are focused on issues like this and will most likely keep the complicated electronics in cars alive for the foreseeable future. FIVA is one group that has called for action on this subject. I have the feeling this all could lead to a thriving industry supporting these things many years after their intended lifespan, sort of like the fervor over yesterday's computers and electronics.
DeleteYes, FIVA (and the national body FFVE in France) are very active in trying to get ahead of the curve on the tide of anti-auto-ism. I have not heard of them starting any initiatives regarding sourcing electronic components. I did not find it on their (rather awkward) web site. Can you point me to something specific?
DeleteNo problem! Even though there's nothing that I could find about it on their website, here's a direct quote as evidence to the contrary. The article itself is more detailed. Let me know if you want me to post the entire contents of it.
Delete"FIVA wants automaker heritage departments to address this (...preserve the technology...) at the 2016 Heritage Forum in Chantilly in early September."
Source: Page 15 of Hemmings Sport & Exotic Car, August 2016
Thanks K2. FIVA looks to form links to as many potential partners as possible (very wise). That initiative about heritage technology is a good way to engage with the auto makers, even though their historical interest has been to force older cars out of the fleet (see various cash-for-clunkers programs, which have been VERY big in Europe). Getting that small concession for registered-as-historic vehicles from the mayor of Paris also was smart. Sadly, all of this points to the inevitability of older cars being ghetto-ized, but maybe we have to accept that. The average drivers of "just an old car" are not politically organized enough to defend their interests
DeleteMy current thinking (subject to change on a whim) is that there will be businesses and groups that will form when the need arises.
ReplyDeleteBut that may not necessarily be what actually happens. Instead, it may be down to the magic of online communication that solves the problem. Videos like the one below are so plentiful already, that it's pretty easy to envision that even the most complicated problems can be solved by resourceful enthusiasts. Even fragile electronic parts made of unobtanium have solutions, work-arounds and hacks. It all just depends on desire.
I'm not so sure that it will be a problem. Well, not MUCH of a problem.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXv7fWtscoY
I better sign up for that high school evening class in electronic repairs.....
Delete